lunoka
Gun-headed
Diving into retrodev
Posts: 55
Homebrew skills: art, music
Fave PCE Shooter: Burning angels
Fave PCE Platformer: Ninja Spirit
Fave PCE Game Overall: Valis 3
Fave PCE RPG: Neutopia
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Post by lunoka on Feb 16, 2023 7:28:41 GMT
Question ... how much was it to manufacture a CD again, lets say with an order of 500? I've explored a little bit that field already. Less than 2 bucks for pressed CDs. Unbeatable cartridge wise. And lowest cost possible with shipping to the final customer. That's why it's my primary goal actually if I ever make a homebrew in the near future. The thing is that CDRom machines were not so popular at that times because of their prices. I would say a 1/5 ratio between cd & cartrige machines. I have a concern about fragility also and compatibility with current CDs. For example, I acquired recently a Super Cdrom² & a Cdrom². The first one works ( but needs a recap, sound problems ). I've tried to burn a Dracula X, the game start but locks just before the boss. My cdrom² don't work, the middle gear is broken and I need to find one. If I'm correct, cds size was about 650 MB back in 90s. Current cds size in shop is at least 700 MB and I fear it's not always suitable for those old machines. Should I only care about the object for itself and let people play with an iso for example ? I've discussed that matter with Touko & MooZ, they think those machines are quite old and always at risk ( lens, motor, gears etc.). On that point, cartridge format is far more robust. Most of my other CD machines don't work well. All my cartridge machines are alive and kicking. Plus I feel a huge nostalgia around me for cartridge support. That's why cartridge format in my opinion is still a valid choice. Nostalgia seems to beat Reason
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Post by elmer on Feb 16, 2023 18:02:15 GMT
So, I don’t know what level of complexity would be required, but I’m seeing a lot of affordable CPLD chips that support 5V at Mouser. Amtel seems to still sell in this market. If you're talking about the ATF150x series, you would need to also purchase Prochip Designer software for $250, and a USB programmer cable for another $230 or so. Lattice also did the same thing a few years ago for their ispMACH4A series chips - took software which was once licensed at no cost, and suddenly assigned a very tangible cost to it. This is the world of 5V CPLDs. Or you can still use WinCUPL for free to design for the ATF150x chips, IIRC. Heck, an SFII "mapper" just needs only 2 (for 2.5MB) or 3 (for 4.0MB) flip-flops to store the selection bits, it's not a complex piece of hardware. While you might run out of inputs (or capability) on a cheap ATF16V8, you should (I think) be fine with an ATF22V10 ... both still manufactured AFAIK, and available in small TSSOP packages. And cheap USB programmers can write to both the ATF16V8 and ATF22V10. Which still isn't the point ... there's a world of difference between coming up with a one-off prototype, and making something that easy enough to build that it's worth somebody's time-and-effort in selling it.
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Post by crisgenjin on Feb 18, 2023 11:30:59 GMT
Question ... how much was it to manufacture a CD again, lets say with an order of 500? I've explored a little bit that field already. Less than 2 bucks for pressed CDs. Unbeatable cartridge wise. And lowest cost possible with shipping to the final customer. That's why it's my primary goal actually if I ever make a homebrew in the near future. The thing is that CDRom machines were not so popular at that times because of their prices. I would say a 1/5 ratio between cd & cartrige machines. I have a concern about fragility also and compatibility with current CDs. For example, I acquired recently a Super Cdrom² & a Cdrom². The first one works ( but needs a recap, sound problems ). I've tried to burn a Dracula X, the game start but locks just before the boss. My cdrom² don't work, the middle gear is broken and I need to find one. If I'm correct, cds size was about 650 MB back in 90s. Current cds size in shop is at least 700 MB and I fear it's not always suitable for those old machines. Should I only care about the object for itself and let people play with an iso for example ? I've discussed that matter with Touko & MooZ, they think those machines are quite old and always at risk ( lens, motor, gears etc.). On that point, cartridge format is far more robust. Most of my other CD machines don't work well. All my cartridge machines are alive and kicking. Plus I feel a huge nostalgia around me for cartridge support. That's why cartridge format in my opinion is still a valid choice. Nostalgia seems to beat Reason Yeah, honestly I think a 4MB cartridge would be a better choice
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punch
Deep Blooper
Posts: 23
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Post by punch on Feb 20, 2023 0:39:05 GMT
This is going to sound rude but this discussion is pointless anyway. HuC is very ROM hungry as I've heard people say before but games are meant to be data-driven -- if your game logic is bursting at the seams there's something seriously wrong with it. Naively programmed 6502 applications are much slimmer, too.
Having a supercharger style device doesn't make sense because A: I don't see any games that are currently really needing it aside from one or two examples I can think of B: Producing hucards will still incur a significant expense regardless C: Whoever is serious enough about having a larger ROM size will probably have no issues making their own design or already be in contact with someone that can design one As for CD systems breaking down, www.youtube.com/watch?v=n2lqo95airI Every game that logically needed a lot of data went CD... homebrew, and in the system's commercial life. If you're going to commit to the hard way I doubt you wouldn't have the hucard design in mind already. An n-bit latch and OR gate is all you need to multiply the amount of ROM you can address UNROM style.
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