nando
Gun-headed
Posts: 97
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Post by nando on May 8, 2018 5:24:22 GMT
And I quote: “The development team MASTERED the Turbo’s color palette and you will not find better tile work in an RPG on the system. ” www.pcengine.co.uk/HTML_Games/Seiya_Monogatari.htmWhat other PCE games color use have just left your jaw drop. Besides Rondo...
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Post by soop on May 8, 2018 12:39:21 GMT
wow! That's really good!
I always though PC Kid 2 had really good colours.
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Post by Lost Monkey on May 8, 2018 12:54:53 GMT
And I quote: “The development team MASTERED the Turbo’s color palette and you will not find better tile work in an RPG on the system. ” www.pcengine.co.uk/HTML_Games/Seiya_Monogatari.htmWhat other PCE games color use have just left your jaw drop. Besides Rondo... I love the look of Dynastic Hero, but a magazine review I remember from back in the day had a line that read something like "C'mon T.T.I. it's time to get a new palette".
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Post by bigusschmuck on May 8, 2018 13:23:43 GMT
I always thought the later Bomberman games looked pretty colorful. Particularly Bomberman 94.
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Post by lukester on May 8, 2018 17:53:02 GMT
Not many pce games have impressed me with colors besides the ones mentioned
The palette is just too damn small.
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Post by spenoza on May 8, 2018 17:57:55 GMT
I don't entirely agree that the palette is too small. I just think many devs are under timetables and constraints that maybe don't allow them a lot of time to experiment much. That's not to say the system couldn't have used a larger system palette, but it didn't stop a lot of the competition.
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Post by sunteam_paul on May 8, 2018 18:01:05 GMT
Costic Fantasy 4ch2 and Blue Blink have some very well chosen palettes, not too garish.
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nando
Gun-headed
Posts: 97
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Post by nando on May 8, 2018 21:42:46 GMT
I don't entirely agree that the palette is too small. I just think many devs are under timetables and constraints that maybe don't allow them a lot of time to experiment much. That's not to say the system couldn't have used a larger system palette, but it didn't stop a lot of the competition. Gaming is a business after all so I can see that being part of the case. The other is just artist experience and a solid understanding of color theory.
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Post by Arkhan on May 8, 2018 23:38:15 GMT
Not many pce games have impressed me with colors besides the ones mentioned The palette is just too damn small. What? lol. Dude it has 512 possible colors you can pick from. That's kind of a lot. When you compare the games to something like the Amiga that had far more colors, the games don't look better really. In some cases, the games look worse. Some Amiga games have TOO MUCH color and look kind of idiotic. Anyway, I think Cosmic Fantasy 3 and 4 had great color usage. Princess Minerva had great color usage too. I really like how that game looks. pcengine.co.uk/HTML_Games/Princess_Minerva.htm
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nando
Gun-headed
Posts: 97
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Post by nando on May 9, 2018 1:13:55 GMT
I love it how I still get to find new gems on this platform. Love the sprite work
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Post by Black_Tiger on May 9, 2018 2:06:53 GMT
Not many pce games have impressed me with colors besides the ones mentioned The palette is just too damn small. The problem with trying to show examples of games with different kinds of good color usage is that you can only post what you happen to find for emulated screenshots from what you have on hand and there's not much out there from the nicer looking games. The other thing is you can name examples, but most people either won't or "can't" play them. Super Darius 2 has some of the nicest coloring of the generation. I don't have screen shots handy. What makes these kinds of discussions the most difficult is any one person's concept of color in pixelart games. It comes up a lot on sega-16, where too many people insist that 4 sub-palettes was fine and that what really killed the Genesis is being stuck with 9-bit color. I think that a lot of people with that mindset believe that the PC Engine's color palette is just a random assortment of colors like the NES. The Genesis palette takes larger jumps in RGB values on the darker and lighter ends of the spectrum, but the PC Engine palette is even right through. I've had to say it too many times in various "console war" discussions, but the lack of some or any bad example in a library is not proof of anything. Only examples of excellence prove anything and it's still then only a minimum benchmark. Most people who champion SNES visuals don't fully understand or appreciate what they're looking at and are blind to the low color HUD layer in most 2D games. The SNES's palette was too large for its own good and if you look closely at or adapt SNES game assets to the PC Engine palette, you quickly notice a pattern of random and mediocre color use. That's why many SNES-to-Genesis port mockups look nicer in many ways. Monochromaticism kills 16-bit era pixelart and most arcade games we love are full of poor choices. System-16 games are particularly bad. It's no different than traditional paintings and why photo realism isn't cherished as much as creative coloring, which tends to look more "real" than real. Which is why you can usually improve upon SNES assets when adapting them to PC Engine color. Most roadblocks you encounter with misc higher bit color conversions is due to staggering of shading and misc detailing built around the original coloring/bit depth. In those cases all that you need to do is rework the pixelart, usually shifting gradient stages. The more detailed the pixelart, the easier it is top do on PC Engine. Everything below has not had any pixelart adjustments to make them work better on PC Engine. I replaced the original colors with PC Engine colors and they all share the same <15 colors per tile/sprite limitations that the PC Engine has. Which one is SNES and which one uses a just too damn small palette? Many of these look noticeably better than the SNES originals. Some have an element or two that may look not as nice, but they still improve on other aspects. I've planned through a full port at the arcade resolution and only a few player's have one or two frames that need pixelart adjustment to avoid flicker. Even without arcade resolution assets, how did we end up with the coloring we got? This screenshot from FX Unit Yuki uses 161 colors. The scene which inspired the background uses 61 colors. If even just one of the Gods of Lightning stage enemies had a couple of their color variants included, it would be pushing 200 colors on-screen. I believe that I made at least a couple alternate palettes for each enemy sprite. I wasn't trying to push color counts, more the opposite I was trying to minimize variety so that there would be fewer cuts when it came time to squeeze it in to Super CD space using Rover's HuC-based engine. It is very easy to design PC Engine assets that would consistently push 200+ colors. Just as SNES games could have much better color, it's much more so for PC Engine. We only got the games that happened to get made, but any that don't feature amazing color are a result of the developer, not the PC Engine's master palette or massive sub-palettes.
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Post by Arkhan on May 9, 2018 6:52:09 GMT
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Post by digipiggy on May 11, 2018 3:25:00 GMT
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Post by digipiggy on May 11, 2018 4:23:11 GMT
Shameless plug here, but I think these are also great examples of colour being used throughout these games.
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Post by Galahad on May 11, 2018 4:31:29 GMT
The 512 colour palette is quite a lot,look what the c64 guys are doing with a 15 colour palette
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